What's confusing is how TT expects pros to pay more for leads than they can make if they land the job! Here's something that TT hopes that pros are not savvy enough to figure out... cost of acquisition! Here's a typical scenario:
Wedding lead: $62 TT fee
A pro needs to speak with 10-15 propects to get hired for a job. Let's call it 12.5 average. 12.5 conversations at $62 each = $775 spent to get hired for a job that only pays $800.
Pro must put 25 hours into this job from start to finish, to earn this $25. Pro is grossing $1 per hour! However, cost of overhead to keep business up and running is $150 per client. Now pro is $125 in the hole, out of pocket to perform job with no pay! But here's the full breakdown:
$800 paid to pro for job
-$775 pro pays to TT
$25 gross to pro
- $150 overhead (calculated by annual overhead divided by # of jobs per year)
- $200 taxes to gov't
- $625 labor not paid for in job ($25 per hour X 25 hours)
- $2500 for job that pro could have been working at legit rates, but wasn't available for due to cheap TT budget rate job
-$3270 LOSS FOR PRO!!!
It is INSANE to think that pros can be charged these rates and still make money! TT is counting on pros being ignorant and not knowing their numbers. I know my numbers and that's why I've been able to be successful on TT. I know when to bid and when not to bid, and that's why I would never be suckered into using IM. I told TT for a year before it was implemented that it would never work for the pros. I warned them of all the things that pros are now screaming about. However, since it enabled TT to turn a $25 profit from a request (5 pros pay $5 each) into a potential profit of $930 per request (15 pros pay $62 ea) it became a brilliant (for TT) no-brainer that there was now a max potential of 186x the profit for them! So, to help pros stay ignorant so they couldn't calculate the cost of acquisition of a client, they hid the cost to bid so pros would bid on jobs they would never bid on, had they known the cost of bidding!
So TT is really relying on pros to be incometent and unaware enough to be ignorant to what they are spending and the cost of acquisition! Once any pro does the math... game over! This means the smart, competent pros leave and the ones that haven't a clue what they're doing and don't know how to run a business, are the ones left to service the clients. How does driving off your best pros put TT out there to garner a reputation for providing quality pros? It doesn't! So clients get bad service and bad products from "pros" that really aren't - and indeed, many "pros" are not legit tax-paying businesses! So requests come in with cheap budgets and they do cheap inferior work and TT gets a reputation for cheap inferior work, so who wants to recommend TT to a friend? The burned client doesn't! Neither does the burned pro! But that's ok, becausue TT adds new pros by the thousands, continuously! So, there's always ignorant new people coming in and paying the crazy rates because they don't know what they're doing! Until they figure it out and go screaming all over the internet about it by the tens of thousands.
When you build a company based on money, people smell it a mile away. When you build a company on providing excellence in service and products, you build lifelong relationships and a sterling reputation. Juss sayin'
Hello and good morning All,
When I started my Plumbing business in 2016 I was over whelmed by the different lead services out there. They will charge charge a annual fee plus a lead charge. I cought caught up in all that thinking this was the right way to go. Fortunately, I was waching TV and viewed one of Thumbtacks commercials. I signed up on a Sunday and received my first two to leads on Monday. They both turned into paying customer's. At that time I could offer Free estimates due to the lead cost being so reasonable priced. At the end of 2016 I became a Top Pro. Even when 2017 came along there were many changes. I stopped using Thumbtack as my only lead service and started using Amazon Home Services instead. Even though they take a percentage of the final invoice amount, I was receiving much better qualified customers. I can ask questions without being charged in order to quantify the customer. Even if I didn't like what the customer had to say I could pass on the lead and not get changed. The only way one gets charged through Amazon is to complete the work. When there leads are incorrect on the customer gives false information Amazon will pay you a trip fee. Thumbtack will only take your money without thinking of what it truly takes to land one of there leads. Customer's don't all ways use the proper terminallogy when it come to work needing to be done. I'm not going to pay to ask a question in order to quantify a customer. Thumbtacks current pricing is now 300%-800% higher since they implemented their new system. When a customer receives up to 15 bibs/quotes this can be to over whelming to them. I have really had to dial in my spending with Thumbtack. I just currently bidded on four leads. One of the leads contacted me and I was charged $23.00 and before this new system went into effect I would have been only charged $3.86. I don't know who came up with this system that you are currently using now. To bid on jobs bindly doesn't benfit the Pros it only benefits Thumbtack. The customer loses the personal touch that needs to be added to each and every bid/quote. Due to Thumbtacks new pricing I have had to really pick and choose which ones I can respond to and not offer any more Free estimates. Today I received a e-mail from Thumbtack informing me of their new lead system of Promoting. I read their e-mail and watched their YouTube video and frankly I am disappointed on how they want to knock out the little guy on fixed budget for advertisement. They think buy adding a 20% discount this will make me jump right into their program. I think not. When I got involved with Thumbtack 2 years ago a small shop like mine had a fighting chance to perform their craft for great people. Just like Google, Yelp, Home Advisor, and Angies List they want you to pay to be listed as one of their service providers. As of now, I currently need to re-evaluate how I continue with my account with Thumbtack. Thumbtacks new method of lead services will knock me out of the listings of my craft and leave me poor trying to land a job through them.
I can NOT commit to a certain amount to pay for these leads on a permanant basis such as weekly, etc ??? I do NOT want my credit card / bank card on file permanently ??? I want customers that are SERIOUS about this. I have seen S - - O often that when asked what do you want the decorators's involvment to be they respond with ( I am not sure yet ) how serious does this sound ??? NOT very serious at all !!! I have also spoken to customers on the phone that TRY and get information out of me about their Interior Decorating projects by asking me certain questions and I have answered them out of courtesy b-u-t how does that help me when they say afterwrd well I just wanted to see what hiring a Decorator would cost and I'll let you know i-f I want you to come out to my home S- - O there I am with NO client at all and they have used me for FREE advice because I did NOT want to be rude to them ??? I also do NOT like the fact that they can see my FULL name but I can NOT see their full name ??? and this is for safety reasons that I say this ??? I also think that the red map that shows the location is by far just too !!! over all and leaves me with NO indiction whats so ever W-H-E-R-E they live because that little red map may give the general area b-u-t in WHAT part of that area are they actually living because once again they can see my address and I can only see their address AFTER I have paid for this lead ??? and after I have paid for this lead I may NOT even get the job ??? I do think that if I call these people they should be charged for a phone consultation even i-f they say that they will call me back i-f they decide to hire a decorator ??? because a lawyer's website will never call a client or let you speck to them unless they have paid a consulatation charge so there's NO WAY a potentaial client can take advantage of them there at their website and even though we are NOT lawyers we deserve that same courtesy that ALL professionals should be shown.
We have all agreed the pricing for Pros is to expensive. The rates should be more consistent. As an Architect, there are basic questions we ask clients to understand the scope of work. What type of building ie restaurants, retail store or office space? This helps us determine the scope of services that will need to be provided or even if the project is a good fit for us. Customers should be required to provide a strong project description so we as Pros are eager to provide a quote.
So when Thumbtack charges $75 for a project; that's 1,500SF, Commerical, renovate a few rooms. I just won't provide a quote for it because of there's inadequate information from the start. Nor do I have available to reach out to 5-6 people daily asking for them to provide additional information.
In my opinion, if Thumbtack charges pros reasonable rates, requires customers to provide better project descriptions. Pros would bid on more projects and consumers would make Thumbtack the go-to pro website. Hence increasing traffic and profits for everyone. As a suggestion maybe visual aids will assist customers when describing their project.
Hello , Thank you for giving me the opportunity to jion in on the discussion. I have been with Thumbtack for a while now and I have seen many changes you have made some I have found to be much better some I did not agree with but lately I have found the pricing for different jobs to be far too much for me to consider to pay . I have seen many jobs for a complete bathroom remodel that would be priced on the low end while on the other hand Someone that would want a few Kitchen cabinets installed I feel is priced far too much for me to reply to. Also I have seen jobs for exterior repairs that would take quiet a bit of work and materials to do the job priced very low ? Some times the customers discription of what repairs they want are vary liminted and you don,t have a lot to base your quote on . I understand some customers have no idea what would be involed to make some of the repairs and that has been an issue that I have ran into a few times in the past. I try to give a fair quote based on several factors that I consider to complete a job ( what materials will be needed ,cost of materials, the distance of the job ,the conditions of the job site itself, and of course the cost to bid on the job. I do a lot of door repairs and installations and have ran into this more than once ,where the customer has stated (door) repair or install and get to the job site and find French doors ,or a door with side lites that I had not considered when I gave a quote for (door) repair. I feel Thumbtack has been very good for both the customer looking for someone to fix an issue they need repaired and I feel they are doing a great job taking care of the hard workers that are looking to make a living useing them to connect the two parties together. Thank You
I also feel that a lot of the jobs posted feel as though the prospective clients are just researching cost, don't know the realistic cost of a commission or are curious. Not serious clients. Perhaps a small fee on the client side would stop less serious posters and stop our fees from being so high. Or that there can be a separate category for people just feeling out how much their job would cost here in which we are charged if hired not if contacted.
I do feel I am losing confidence in how many of these jobs are legitmate prospects.