Your feedback in action: Refund policy update.
Comments
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I will say this you are correct instant booking is here to stay. We have to either learn to adapt to it or accept it.
We have to start looking at spending money on Thumbtack as a lead generation platform on a month-to-month basis more so than a week to week basis there are some weeks I'm sure that it's going to seem like bizarre that we're not making any money however when you look at your whole monthly profit and loss the amount that we spend on leads surely can't compensate to what we've made in profit.
It's kind of like going to McDonald's and asking McDonald's to change their menu price for you. If they serve a burger for a dollar and you go in there and tell him you want to pay $0.60 they're probably not going to change their price just like I assume Thumbtack will never just change their prices again. For the least.
It's a business model and we must adapt to it as professionals and either make it work or search work elsewhere. I am probably aware that many pros have fled the Thumbtack platform and are seeking work elsewhere. But on a positive note that should mean that there are many new spaces to fill for the contractors to decide to stay and if we study the system we can find the ways to still make money. I'm in seven different categories and I'm constantly studying which category makes me the most money the best roi and I'm contemplating changing out of categories that don't make money compared to the ones that do make money.
I hate to say it but Thumbtack is not really responsible whether we make a profit or a loss. They have an incredible amount of leads and for me it still works. I pray for every other contractor that they find the right balance and choose what's best for them and the family
. wishing you well from FL ❤️
Bret. A top pro
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Luxor. You are absolutely correct
This is why Thumbtack is such a hard algorithm to understand. It's not fair for me to give advice as a landscape contractor compared to your business model as a carpet cleaner. And I must apologize that I'm always pro thumbtack because in the landscaping industry it still makes sense because of exactly what you're saying on average landscaping jobs that we do that if we pay an instant booking for $120 is going to generate 10 to $20,000 in a sale
Now we do have lower categories that will never exceed say more than a couple hundred dollars into your point you're absolutely correct if we sold a say a tree planting job that's only going to net $200 and then we paid $120 for the instant booking by the time you buy the plant pay for the call and install the plant you've lost money. To that I understand the frustration. However for us we have probably three categories the net huge jobs were a safer a small family business I can generate $300,000 a year it's because of the large token jobs that it makes sense. I'm praying that you find the right answer or that this can be constantly worked on. I know you don't know me from adam. But I am on the top pro advisory board and we have been literally beating this up for 2 years trying to find solutions. The change is coming there are some things that were making it a little more workable however this is across the whole spectrum of 270 or 300 job categories and there has to be an answer for each category specifically so that people don't give up and quit the platform. I'm also always available by phone if you need to talk about any of this at 386-500-8217. I put myself out here because I care about other pros on the platform. There are people that probably don't like me for my candor but I'm telling you I'm not employed by Thumbtack I'm just a simple man trying to feed my family and I will continue to make the platform work for me and my family and I will gladly help you to do the same thing
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You're a very positive person. Unfortunately it's clear that Thumbtack is manipulating Pros with their silly terms and conditions. Charging $100 plus on a job that is probably estimated for $150 and then giving professionals the option of a refund even when they can clearly see that the customer booked and fled. The platform is very manipulative. It pushes the customer through the process to click on instant booking. It's very slick for unknowing customers who don't know what it's costing the pro. If you try going on the platform as a customer you will see what I'm talking about. They don't really give you the option to inquire for an estimate, it sort of automates you through to click on instant booking and they don't even give the customer any conditions to accept any kind of agreement such as making sure this is a for sure booking that they are going to commit to. If they wanted to do better by Pros, they would at least collect a deposit from a customer for instant booking which is very standard in all businesses. But they honestly just simply don't give a crap about pros. Not one bit. It's nice that it's working for you, I'm sure you are one of the few Pros that is helping them to stay current. I'm sure their turnover rate with professionals is out the window
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Actually that's an amazing idea that you just came up with. I'm being honest I'm not blowing you full of smoke. This the number one complaint we hear on the board is from people about instant booking is the people are unaware that they're literally booking somebody to do the job and the pro thinks they're already hired. If the client had to put some of their skin say to use the instant book and say $100 deposit or something where they had the same equal money as what the pros being in charge that would definitely change the algorithm. If every time instant booking was utilized the top pro got that same amount as a deposit that would really really make sense believe me sir if you're okay with it I'll push this idea forward
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That's amazing, I'm glad the platform is working for somebody.
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Yes of course. Please push it forward. The thing is, if they were serious about instant booking working like they actually intended, then the customer should be willing to pay / ready to commit to the job right? Otherwise they are not committed and therefore we are being charged for a committed lead according to their whole idea about instant booking. That was their whole reason that they tried to sell us about instant booking - that although the lead prices were higher, it was a committed/booked job and therefore we didn't have to go through multiple leads to book a job. But is simply doesn't work that way because the customers are not held accountable and they are also blindly clicking that button without knowing in fact what that button means. Of course they can just disappear Without a Trace because there is no card on file or anything attached to them. Everyone knows that industry standards for service professionals have a deposit, cancellation window, minimums, estimates etc. They are trying to change what has been an industry standard for decades probably. And it doesn't work like this, those terms and conditions that professionals have are there for a reason.
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I really appreciate the ongoing conversation happening here, and the different perspectives represented. Thank you all for keeping it constructive, when I am sure there is a lot of frustration. These things are top of mind for teams at Thumbtack too - understanding how to increase customer comprehension and commitment, as well as understanding how to improve the booking experience. Thank you for continuing to provide very candid feedback and insights.
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@Bretdouglas You should host a seminar on how to not lose money on Thumbtack and generate 30,000 a month using its platform. I'm curious to know what you're doing, I'm sure I'm not the only one.
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That's a great point I would absolutely love to do that to help fellow pros. But I would be remiss and thinking every category and every job title would do the same. I'm in commercial landscape installation which generates huge numbers but doesn't always mean huge profits. Like right now I'm working on a $10,000 job that I sold on Thumbtack that'll take a week but maybe five of that is labor or profit. It's really not about the numbers it's the fact that I've never lost a single week in all the years I've been using thumbtack. We have about six or seven categories that we bid on and we always make money. You can reach me at 386-500-8217 I'd love to talk with you on the phone and see if I can help you to conquer the Thumbtack app
Warm regards
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This is a great update! Extending the cancellation window to 1 hour ⏳ makes a big difference and gives pros more flexibility 🙌. It’s also a relief to not feel pressured to respond late at night 🌙. Thanks for listening to feedback and making these improvements! 👍😊
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Its a start. To me it proves that Thumbtack Senior Management are listening to the pro advisory board and the pros in general. We're starting to see some shifting towards the pros benefit. I'm all in for it and if we can do anything else to help people please reach out to us and let us know we're all in this together when one of us succeeds we should all succeed
Warm regards Brett Douglas
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@Bretdouglas That is great that some people are making money even with the instant book feature. Your industry in specific because it has high ticket prices. However, many of us who are bidding for $50, $100,$200 even $500 jobs have a different outcome because the average cost of lead in my case was at least around $100, in some cases $180 and so forth. So just imagine if your IB leads cost you $1,000, $2,000, $5,000… Maybe you wouldn't be as successful as you are today. I think your industry is slipping through the cracks and in my guess, they are going to catch onto it and raise your IB lead prices, then your narrative won't feel the same. I think Thumbtack pushed this feature way too soon and didn't think it throughly. If they raised higher ticket leads, they wouldn't have to gouge at smaller pros eyes like us cleaners. The service industry is already flooded with people who want to pay rock bottom prices- pushing pros to work for min wage or even less after expenses, then you have these ridiculous high lead costs to add on top of it. Through my research, I see there are always new pros with terrible or no ratings on Thumbtack- and that leads me to believe that people don't stick around long enough due to lead cost, and therefore the only pros available are those that are new and haven't been burnt out yet.
I love your attitude. That was how I felt before IG. I was on cloud 9 bringing in 20-30k monthly. That all died instantly. Instant Booking= Instant Death
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Thank you for your question. You will only receive bookings if they match the targeting preferences that you've set for your business. If you're receiving leads that aren't a good fit for you, it may be time to review your targeting preferences to see if there's something that needs adjusting.
^^^^In response to the above. This is another demonstration of how you guys in the backside of the application don't truly understand how the service profession really works. It doesn't matter what our target preferences are. In my case, there are people who would book me for extreme/hazard/hoarder homes and they would input the details of their home (as in rooms, sq footage etc) then when we get there it's a job way outside of the scope and we are forced to do the cleaning for the amount they booked through the system. There are so many issues with instant booking that you guys are not truly grasping and there is always more to assess in the home than the standard questions your guys have in the scoping.
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@Average_joe1 Let’s just get rid of the requirement that we must accept instant bookings thanks
^^^Yeah they are just not hearing us. How many people have to say this? They won't take it off until we all stay off and not throw our money into this shredder
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In my top months I was spending close to $7,000 on leads monthly. Now I spend ZERO. I wonder if they have really caught up with the math of what the IB feature is really costing them.
I come on here from time to time to see what has changed (hardly anything) and what people are saying (everyone hates IB). One thing I will say that came good of this is I am now hustling hard on landing other larger contracts on my own outside of this platform and am putting my money into google and other platforms. Don't know why they don't want a piece of the pie and would rather have a bunch of new accounts that they promise this "clever" IB feature to until they burn out and drop out, collecting only a few hundred dollars at a time from them.
THUMBTACK DECISION MAKERS IN CONFERENCES:
- Keep loyal pros who spend thousands of dollars monthly on our platform and have a long history of great ratings, know how the platform works, know how to provide great services to our customer base? NEH!!
2. Keep this Instant Book feature that is making everyone drop out, then we can only milk the new naive pros who have no history on our platform, don't know how to communicate with customers and don't know how to provide great services, have never used us before so they don't know what they are in for. Let's let them create a profile, throw some leads at them mixed with a few Instant Bookings that don't necessarily convert, and let them drown and find out they are losing money in a few weeks then drop out. Then it's on to the next! Oh yeah, also our customer base will stop using Thumbtack altogether because it will be known as the platform that has crappy service pros. HECK YEAH!!!
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thanks https://community.thumbtack.com/ for sharing
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"Thumbtack’s updated refund policy seems like a step in the right direction for building more trust with both customers and pros. Clearer guidelines on when refunds are applicable ensure that everyone knows what to expect, reducing friction. It’s great to see that Thumbtack is listening to feedback, from the community and adjusting to make the process more transparent. For pros, I think it’s crucial that these policies are well-communicated to avoid any confusion moving forward. What’s everyone’s experience with the new changes so far?"
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How do we do this? And pass on crappy leads? I’ve spent several hundred in my first few weeks for 6 leads, which of as now one might be panning out. Yesterday I was charged almost $50 for a lead which is for airfare only and I wouldn’t make a dime on. We should not be paying out of our budgeted weekly money for leads that are not real.
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@SME I'm sorry that this happened! As a former business owner and Thumbtack pro, I know how frustrating this can be. What is the "norm" for travel agencies? Are you able/allowed to charge a fee for booking someone's airfare? If not, I wonder if you could either 1) remove "airfare" from the type of travel you can book or 2) try putting something about not being able to only book airfare in your intro paragraph? You'll be matched with jobs that align with your preferences, and since you do have airfare selected, it wouldn't be eligible for a refund. We have bi-weekly networking hours over Zoom where you could meet some other Thumbtack pros and see if they have any ideas, too. They always have GENIUS ideas that I would never think of myself for dealing with scenarios like this! We call these sessions "CommuniTEA" if you want to see if you can join - all the info is here. We'd love to have you there! I'd also recommend a few other things after checking out your profile:
- Revisit your Max Lead Prices often to make sure that the prices you have set work for you and your business - you aren't locked into those for any time period, so you can play around with those and see what works for you.
- Get some more reviews if you can - you can have up to 10 unverified reviews (reviews that are from outside Thumbtack). You are greatly more likely to be hired if you have 5+ reviews.
- Add some photos - this could be happy people on their trip that you booked, pics of resorts where you book travel, pics of you at work, pics of any credentials that you have, etc - anything that will make your profile standout to potential customers
- If you can attend CommuniTEA the group will have great ideas in general for following up with leads, too. This is a great resource of pros who live and breathe using Thumbtack and other sources to grow their businesses.
Hope this helps even if just a little! And sending all the "panning out" vibes for the other lead!
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@DustiO Thanks for your response. Yes, I can and do charge a booking fee for "air only" however I feel like it would be unethical and greedy to charge $50 or more for doing so and that is roughly what the lead cost me — so even if they did book with me, I would break even and not be paid for my time.
I am happy to book airfare as part of a package trip (with a cruise or hotel/vacation rental/villa stays), so I don't want to dissuade clients by not having airfare listed at all. I'll make mention of that in my profile, though I'm getting the feeling that clients are not reading profiles (or Thumbtack is not) before sending a lead to the Pro. If I put something about not being willing to book economy airfare only in my intro paragraph and then I am given a paid lead for "the cheapest" or economy airfare only, would I get a refund in that case?Thanks for the other tips — I will work on those — but I am not willing to spend a bunch more money until I see some bookings and results. Reviews and pictures are certainly doable though. And I will attend a "CommuniTEA."
Of the 6 paid leads that I have received, only two of them have read and responded to my responses. Four have gone unread and unresponded to and I have also texted them (and two of them had read receipts turned on so I know that they saw my message). Additionally, I have sent 10 detailed emails to 'opportunities', often before the Pro(s) they chose responded, but nothing yet, unfortunately.
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Maybe the whole problem we're having is that the advisory board is packed with people who do large dollar jobs that don't have a clue about the problems everyone else experiences daily.
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@structuralguy65 there are a variety of categories, business sizes and job sizes represented, not all do large scale jobs. We have handymen, painters, electricians, plumbers, home inspectors, junk removers, home organizers, etc. - all who take on smaller jobs.
Understanding that not all users have the same experience, we appreciate the feedback both from larger pros like @Bretdouglas and pros who may do smaller dollar jobs like yourself.
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Hi, any idea why my refund request for this bad lead was denied? The automated email I received said this "matches your travel, job and availability preferences," when it clearly doesn't. If I went and did this work, I'd be brought up on charges in front of my state board and have my license suspended.
Also, I responded in 4 minutes.
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@structuralguy65 I would try following up with support via email or a phone call to see if you can add more context to the refund request. I might also recommend removing the "other" option from your preferences, since this is the way this request came in (that's what the customer selected). Maybe try deselecting that and see if it impacts the types of leads that you get?
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(I am following up on this particular lead on my end too and will let you know if I can find anything else out)
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It has been refunded @structuralguy65 :)
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@DustiO thank you for that help, but I got denied again for another duplicate posting. Husband and wife literally posted the same exact description, for the same work, at the same property. It's ridiculous that pro's should have to get charged twice when that happens.
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it happens all the time to me I get a lead for a commercial mowing job but it’s actually a house and then they deny my request for refund even though I don’t advertise for residential mowing
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@Average_joe1 you have to be hyper vigilant that Thumbtack doesn't change the nature of your business.
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